It Starts With Attraction
Revealing secrets on how to become the most attractive you can be Physically, Intellectually, Emotionally and Spiritually (or as us insiders call it...the PIES). Listen to weekly episodes. Join a course or get more info at kimberlybeamholmes.com
It Starts With Attraction
The 1 Problem Most Marriages Face
Have a question you want answered? Submit it here!
Can our past really dictate the health of our current relationships? Join us in this enlightening episode where we uncover the profound influence of unresolved emotions on our interactions today. With Dr. Chip Dodd, an esteemed expert in emotional and spiritual counseling, we explore how understanding and managing our feelings can be the key to personal and relational well-being. Dr. Dodd shares his pioneering spiritual root system philosophy, blending ancient wisdom with modern neuroscience to explain how our hearts govern our experiences and relationships.
Through heartfelt stories and practical advice, we dive deep into emotional regulation, the importance of processing feelings, and the power of resonance and revision in building trust. From navigating the complexities of marriage to understanding the four essential questions that help manage emotions, we emphasize the necessity of addressing emotional history to cultivate healthier connections. Dr. Dodd's insights are complemented by relatable anecdotes, including the impact of childhood experiences on adult relationships, revealing the intricate dynamics of emotional responsibility and empathy.
In our journey towards emotional healing, we highlight the shared humanity that binds us all, emphasizing the resilience of the human heart. Discover how identifying and expressing emotions truthfully can foster genuine connections and mutual understanding. We also discuss valuable resources such as 12-step groups for emotional support, underscoring the importance of finding trustworthy individuals to share vulnerabilities with. This episode offers a transformative perspective on emotional well-being, encouraging listeners to embrace their feelings for a more connected and compassionate life.
Today's Guest: Dr. Chip Dodd
The Voice of the Heart Book
Chip Dodd's Podcasts
The Boy & The Ogre: Finding Freedom From Codependency
Your Host: Kimberly Beam Holmes, Expert in Self-Improvement and Relationships
Kimberly Beam Holmes has applied her master's degree in psychology for over ten years, acting as the CEO of Marriage Helper & CEO and Creator of PIES University, being a wife and mother herself, and researching how attraction affects relationships. Her videos, podcasts, and following reach over 500,000 people a month who are making changes and becoming the best they can be.
🔗 Website: https://itstartswithattraction.com
📱 Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/kimberlybeamholmes
👀 TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@kimberlybeamholmes
Follow our other channels!
📺 https://youtube.com/@UC7gCCAhhQvD3MBpKpI_4g6w
📺 https://youtube.com/@UCEOibktrLPG4ufxidR8I4UQ
Almost every one of our struggles with feelings has to do with our history, so it means you need healing from your past to write the story of your own relationship. To live in a healthy relationship, we need to be answered four questions when am I? What am I doing with it? What happened? And then the last question is what's it like? The one problem that most couples bring, at least for me over the past 30 years, is we have a communication issue and it's like no, you don't. You have a not taking ownership of your feelings issue, and then you don't know what to do with them.
Speaker 2:Today we're going to be talking about a subject that is some people's absolute least favorite thing in the world to talk about, which means you absolutely need to listen to this episode. Today we're talking about feelings. I'm joined today with Dr Chip Dodd. Dr Dodd has been in the counseling arena for decades and has done amazing work. Back in the early 1990s, he actually created what he calls the spiritual root system, and it's his counseling philosophy that he's taken with him to several different counseling centers that he has started. He currently lives in the Nashville Tennessee area, just a little bit outside of it, and continues to work by mentoring different counseling centers that he has helped start that are using his methodologies.
Speaker 2:But he's most well known for authoring the book the Voice of the Heart, which we will definitely talk a lot about. In this episode we get into why people aren't aware of the feelings that they feel, what it means to actually feel your feelings and to take personal responsibility for them instead of trying to make someone else take responsibility for them, and many more things. Let's dive into today's episode. Well, dr Dodd, I am super excited to have you on the show today. Your book, the Voice of the Heart, has been very well known and well renowned in many different circles for several years, and really a lot of what you talk about is so pertinent to what people are experiencing today, even though you wrote this book probably almost 25 years ago. Can you start by telling us what is the spiritual root system that you talk so much about?
Speaker 1:Thank you, kimberly. The spiritual root system is, honestly, it's using words to talk about how we're actually created, and it turns out that human beings and neuroscience has finally validated something we've known for actually some centuries, but we run away from it the human beings that were actually born as and remain emotional and spiritual creatures, who are created to do one thing in life, and that is live fully. But we can't find full life unless we're doing so in relationship with ourselves, others and God. Well, it turns out that relationship, more than it's rooted in the mind you know the brain relationship is actually rooted in the heart. You know the brain Relationship is actually rooted in the heart. It's a matter of the heart, and neuroscience says that you literally come out of the womb looking for who's looking for you.
Speaker 1:The Bible says that guard your heart, or attend to your heart with great diligence, because out of it flow all the issues of life. And so the spiritual root system is a description of how we're really made, emotionally and spiritually. So it starts with that. The heart is made up of five characteristics what we feel, what we need, what we desire, what we long for and what we hope, and each of those has a discerned definition. And so everything we do in life, we feel things before we think things even, and then neuroscience has backed that up.
Speaker 1:So we're feeling creatures, and unless we know our feelings, we won't know our needs, we won't know our desire, our longings or our hope, because it's the doorway into us. And so we're thinking, and we're feeling creatures who have developed the ability to think. We're not thinking creatures who have to just simply deal with feelings. So it turns out that everything we do starts with what we feel, rather than our thinking having command of us. The truth is, our feelings have more influence over us than our thinking, so we really need to attend to those things. So the spiritual root system is a foundational belief system out of which grow a lot of therapeutic theories, a lot of therapeutic techniques and so on. So we're feeling creatures, and unless you know your feelings, it's going to be hard to live in fully in relationship.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you know, it's so funny. We were having this conversation just this morning in the office. No-transcript. Do people like what things happen in life, that that people disconnect from their feelings, that they aren't able to state what their feelings are, and how can someone move towards being able to enunciate that?
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's, that's a great question, the. You know it was funny when, when the voice of the heart, the book came out. I'd already been working with it for some years before I actually wrote the book. But when the book came out, basically I remember telling Sonia who I'm married to. I said you know, this is going to be big, this is going to be. I mean, this has transformed me because the only answer I knew to what are you feeling is OK or fine. And so when I got this recognition, this, oh my goodness, I'm awake. I'm awake, I'm alive, I'm like living. It's painful but worth it. And when the book came out, I told science can be great. And a year later, I'm like all I hear are crickets. And then, a year later, I'm like all I hear are crickets. You know, it's like a comedian's on stage outdoors that lays out his jokes and nobody laughs. But the crickets, you can hear them in the background. And I remember telling her I said, sonia, I thought it was going to be big, that we would have people awakening and, you know, big transformation. And she said look, you know what. You were called to just write the book because it's yours, you benefited, so leave it alone. Let it happen. Fifteen years later, 15 years later, it's now. It lives on the top 100, really the top 10 of best religious counseling books, best Christian counseling books in the world. I mean, it's almost like I wrote it ahead of our time.
Speaker 1:Neuroscience follows up about 12 years ago with we're created, we're born looking for us, looking for us, we're relational creatures. And then, honestly, I started a treatment center using the book and men. I was mostly treating men. Men began to do that which they were born to do return to how they're made so that others around them could benefit wives, children, family, friends, others. And so we've been trained over time, men and women, society. We've all been trained to reject what we feel, because feelings make us vulnerable, feelings make us known, feelings make us in need, and so there are three things that have really been very powerful to block feelings in men and women. Number one is ignorance in men and women. Number one is ignorance. I mean we've been trained to ignore and we're living in societies, cultures and families that have labeled feelings as non-essentials. So just ignore them. That's water on the bridge, forget about it. And then two is denial If you want to belong and matter in your family, then we don't see what's happening, we don't feel because there's a problem in the family. We don't want it exposed, because then we have to have feelings once we expose it, so maintaining the status quo or denial, and then the most tragic form is out and out trauma, in other words.
Speaker 1:And trauma is experiencing something and having to hide the feelings because the feelings won't matter, don't matter. And trauma occurs when you have nowhere to go with the pain you've experienced. Because if a person can experience a great, let's say, trauma down the street, and then if you have a home to go to and you come back home and you share the impact of what happened, the story, what's going to happen inevitably is you're going to have feelings related to the story and then someone will join you in your story and you can have healing because we'll make the relationship, that which is inside me meet someone outside me who can care about what's inside me. We have relational bonding and healing. And so trauma blocks feelings because they have to freeze.
Speaker 1:Denial blocks feelings so that I won't belong and matter if I have them, and ignorance blocks feelings. We don't even know they're there. I mean the culture itself just practices a life that's shallow, generally empty, and yet it works. So those three things tend to be very powerful things, and then I'll stop with that. But those three things tend to be the most powerful, I'll stop with that. But those, those three things tend to be the most powerful.
Speaker 1:And see, well, the need to belong and matter are the two most powerful needs that a human being has. They're two primary needs. They are equivalent to the heart as food is to the body. So I mean they're that powerful. I cannot stress this enough. People will do anything to belong and matter. So we're going to belong and matter one way or another. So if I belong and matter through ignorance, great. If I belong and matter through denial, great. If I belong and matter through hiding trauma or running from trauma or compensating, then great. But I'm created to belong in matter by being known from the inside out, because I'm really made to find fulfillment through relationship me with me, me being able to articulate what's happening in me, me with others who can do the same, and then the God, who is relational. So, ultimately, if God's not relational, I can't be in relationship with God. Yeah, we really are made for relationship. Belonging to mattering is very, very powerful.
Speaker 2:Now could someone and I think we can all think of the extreme where, if someone is suppressing these feelings, that it's going to lead to issues. But could the opposite be true too? Like, is there a time in which someone's over-identifying or over-indulging in those feelings to try and belong?
Speaker 1:That's a great question and because we make the mistake that feelings are the answer. But see, feelings are nothing but an expression of needs I need to name and responsibility I need to take. Ok. So a lot of people will have feelings and what they're really saying is I'm having a feeling and therefore you've got a demand upon you. I'm having a feeling. Now you've got a job, I'm having a feeling. You need to understand my feeling and your job to fix it.
Speaker 1:Those people really aren't, believe it or not. This sounds weird, but they're really not owning, taking ownership of what they're feeling. They're reacting to their feelings. They're not being responsible. I feel hurt. This is mine and I need. Can you, would you? If you can't, then I need to address it some other way. But I need healing, versus. If you don't do this, I'm going to, and then I start labeling you with consequences, threats.
Speaker 1:So feelings aren't weapons, they're not threats. They're taking ownership of being needing, of needing to connect for a purpose. Because see the human, the brain, like when I'm having a lot of feelings, it just indicates, like, if I'm sad or hurt, like, for example, let's just use sadness If I'm sad, it means I've lost something that is valuable to me and there's a purpose in sadness. It's there in us to allow us to reach for what we need. And sadness is a need for comfort. It's a need for relief because something's been taken from me. I don't have the energy of acting as if it's not there. I need someone to support me, I need someone to lean on, and so that need takes me to a place that sadness is made to bring me to. Eventually is acceptance to restrengthen me.
Speaker 1:So a feeling, if I'm responsible with my feelings, I will connect them to my needs and then I'll ask for what I need, and then the hope is I will get it. But sadness isn't a demand. It's a process that opens me up to getting what I'm made to have. That returns me to living fully. So there's a cycle. So if I own my feelings, I'll get the benefit of them. Versus I have a feeling you need to make me okay. I don't receive the benefit. I escape, and most people are doing everything they can to try to escape from having to deal with their feelings.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that's where a lot of marriage, troubles occur.
Speaker 2:I was about to say you and I both have probably seen this. I mean, this exact thing you're talking about is such an issue where people say, well, I am angry and because of something you did, now you need to fix it, or I am sad because of something you did, Now you need to fix it. So I would love for you if you could give some examples or a story that the listeners could like take and understand how this works, Because a lot of people are probably sitting there right now thinking wait a minute, what do you mean? I'm supposed to fix something that someone else did.
Speaker 1:Yes.
Speaker 2:Or that they feel like someone else did.
Speaker 1:Yes, well, this is an old story, it's kind of a funny story, but I think funny anyway. But years ago, sonia and I were like and I can tell you about one last night, for that matter, if you want to talk Real life right now we had been riding scooters and we had left a restaurant, st Augustine, and and she was actually introduced me to scooters because she'd done it before and so so we were getting on the scooters and I'm 25 feet away from her, you know, getting on my scooter, and she started hers and she accidentally hit the gas and she sort of like ran it into the wall, like two feet away, and then she yells at me champ, and I'm like what? She goes and I'm kind of like you're like you didn't stop this. I'm like Sonia, I'm 25 feet away from you, and she said something beautifully. It was so precious I melted actually. She goes, you are supposed to rescue me and I went, but I can't. I'm 25 feet away, but it was so precious because she said it gently and she said it without. It wasn't like a judgment, I'm blaming you, it was an admission. I wish that there were someone in my life and world who could stop me from having to be in pain with things that are just sad and hurtful and lonely and scary and angering and shameful and guilty, and I wish that I had a place to go where life didn't hurt and on some level I wish that you could be that person, and when you're not, I'm going to accuse you. Now, what I mean by that is when you're little.
Speaker 1:Most families are raising children in ignorance and in denial and in no place to go, with pain down the street, trauma and now children many children are being raised in pampering or entitlement, and all four of those things are people having feelings and finding ways to avoid them. So almost in every marriage, when we have feelings, almost no one has trained us to know what to do with them except to deflect them, accuse them, because no one raised us to know. So, almost in every marriage, when the fighting starts and there needs to be fight, you got to fight because intimacy is a fight. You struggle. You got to be able to struggle because life is happening while you're married and marriage itself is a freaking miracle. It's a mystery. I'll tell you how common, if you want me to, but my opinion.
Speaker 1:But almost every one of our marital struggles have to do with not knowing how to do feelings, not knowing what to do with feelings and knowing that feelings are normal, they're not the enemy, they're not a threat. But when we were growing up, feelings were the enemy and feelings were a threat. So if we have feelings, we become dysregulated, and dysregulation means I'm not okay inside me and I'm looking around outside me to make me something better. And if somebody can tolerate my feelings, like I did with Sonia that day, I said well. I said Sonia, I'm over here, I couldn't help you. She said, but you need to rescue me. And I went I'm sorry, I couldn't, I can't, and she's like I know. And so I was dysregulated, she was dysregulated.
Speaker 1:I told the truth, admitted powerlessness. She told the truth, I wish there was someone who could fix everything, and I related to that. So we both had a thing called resonance, which means oh, like, like, we can help each other, but we can't fix each other, we can trust each other. And it's like it was a beautiful moment for me and an admission for her. And then after that we have a thing called revision admission for her, and then after that we have a thing called revision.
Speaker 1:And so the brain, the heart, we're always trying to find regulation, which is a form of safety and connection. Resonance means I can trust you and revision means I can write a new story. And so if we will face what we were taught about feelings and there are only eight feelings with the Voice of the Heart's a big deal book, I mean, I promise you it's like reading about the three primary colors and then you can become an artist. Or the eight musical notes and you can become a composer. So the eight feelings, then you can become somebody who lives fully in relationship. And so in many ways, almost every one of our struggles with feelings has to do with our history more than our present time. So feelings, if you react to them or hide them or suppress them, it's because you grew up belonging and mattering by being ignorant, in denial or in trauma. So it means you need healing from your past to write the story of your own relationship. Yeah, versus a relationship repetition.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I mean, is that where you recommend people start to go through their history?
Speaker 1:Yes, I think that we have four questions we need to answer when it comes to feelings and the Living With Heart podcast, called Living With Heart from Birth to Death. We start at the beginning, we go through a ton of things like this, but one of the episodes is about the four essential questions and to live in a healthy relationship, we need to be answered four questions. Number one I need to be able to answer where am I answer four questions. Number one I need to be able to answer where am I? Okay, and that's a feeling response For people out there who are Christians or biblical. The first question God ever asked in the book of Genesis, the scriptures themselves is where are you? And the question was from the heart of God to the heart of humanity. And the response was I was afraid, so I hid. It was an admission of the truth of my heart and that did not stop the relationship. It restarted the relationship. So where am I? Is me facing what I feel and being able to tell the truth about it? Where am I? And a lot of people don't know what they feel, so they have to go. Well, what would it be like for another person? What would it be like for a child. What's it kind of like? You know? Kind of use metaphors to describe until you finally come down to the essential ingredient.
Speaker 1:I feel fear, I feel sad, I feel hurt. I feel sad, I feel hurt, I feel lonely Because until you name what something is, you don't know what to do with it. You got to know where you are, to know where you want to go. So when I feel lonely, I know I need relationship. When I feel sad, I know I need comfort. When I feel hurt, I know I need a healing. When I feel fear, I know I need help. When I feel anger, it means I'm either I'm really willing to be in pain for something, which is more confusing to a lot of people. When I feel guilt, I need to say I'm sorry. I mean, feelings are there to lead us somewhere, not to just have them. So where am I?
Speaker 1:And then the next question is what am I doing with it? What am I doing with what I feel? Am I being truthful? Am I hiding it? Am I defending it or am I telling the truth about it? So that's number two. Number three is what happened? What's happening, in other words, what happened to make me hide, what's happening to make me, and that's taking responsibility. That's not like they made me. It's like what am I doing it for? It's like looking in the mirror and then also, in that, what happened or what's happening, who can help me look in the mirror too? I mean, it's like I can look in the mirror, but who sees behind me? Who in my life knows to tell me what they see me doing or to help me see what the story is? And then the last question is what's it like? So we need to be answered.
Speaker 1:Those four questions. Those are four forms of taking ownership and being responsible in my own life, which makes me available to be trusted, to be believed, to be dependable, in other words. And therefore a person can find safety with me, they can find trust with me, they can find security with me, which means they can bring the truth of themselves to me, and they also don't have to be defended with me. That's called a relationship, it's called intimacy.
Speaker 1:So those four questions and then what's it like is describing what's it like to be stuck or trapped, or lonely, or hurt, or sad, or struggling in a marriage. But the one problem that most couples bring, at least for me over the past 30 years is we have a communication issue and it's like no, you don't, you have a not taking ownership of your feelings issue and then you don't know what to do with them. So communication usually means she doesn't understand me, he doesn't understand me, they don't agree with me, they agree with me. So it's really come in and say we have a communications issue means my partner has a problem.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:My wife has a problem. My husband has a problem.
Speaker 2:I'm thinking about my two kids. They're nine and seven and a common thing that they get upset or sad about or hurt. I should probably ask them which of the feelings. But he took this from me. Now I'm sad. He needs to give it back, Like the only way I'm going to be happy again is if he, my brother this is my daughter saying it If he, my brother, fixes his ways right and gives it back to me.
Speaker 2:So there's probably so many versions of that that we do as adults, right? So there's probably so many versions of that that we do as adults, right? Like I'm sad because this person hurt me in some way. The only way is for them to make it right. So then, how do so? Like? Take the nine-year-old, my nine-year-old daughter. Yeah, ideal way that I handle that as her mom, that she handles that as you know, with her brother, for there to be the best possible resolution for relational intimacy.
Speaker 1:And this is where it's really, you know, because we almost all of us are trained to think life is an either or, like wrong, fair, just, unjust and so. But it's a both and. So when your daughter says I'm sad because he took that from me, he needs to give that back, well, it's like that's true and not true. Okay, and the truth is that if he does give it back, I will have what I did have back, but I'm still going to be sad. So, but what? What part does the brother play in actually repairing the sadness? Because the sadness is a wound. It's like some something I believed is gone or not true. So if he gives the toy back, then your daughter won't have the pain of something stolen from her the anger part, the taking, the violation of boundaries but she still has a broken relationship. So the toy itself doesn't fix anything, it doesn't make reparation, doesn't make repair. But if the brother says, like I know they're very young children, but they've got to learn this over time, that's the beauty. What we all need to learn is doing unto others, as I'd have them do unto me. So if the brother kind of finally goes oh, you know, if you'd done that to me I would be sad too. So I'm sorry, I took the toy and that's what we're hoping through feelings to not learn right wrong, but how to live the truth that what I do impacts you, because what you've done has impacted me. And let me say it another way what makes feelings so valuable? Empathy, which is I know what pain is. Empathy means I feel pain. Empathy is my pain okay in pain. And so if I know what feelings are and I know what tears are and I know what hurt is and I know what laughter is and I know what hurt is and I know what laughter is, and there's someone in my life called a parent who will attend to those things in a true way, what's amazing is that I will value my feelings as having worth. Then, when I see another human being having tears or laughter or anger or hurt, I go oh, I know what that's like, I can identify and therefore I can care. And therefore, because someone helped me with my sadness when a toy was taken, I can see their sadness. Not only that, but also I probably don't want to take their toy because I know what it's like for me. So, using the feelings as valid, but using the feelings as I'm sorry, you're sad. I know that hurts. I wish he hadn't done that and, like you, need to give the toy back. And the thing is, I'm looking forward to a day when you'll also be sorry. So we need to learn how to have sorrow for what we do, because someone was sorry for what happened to me.
Speaker 1:Parents' job is to validate children's feelings so they can wind up caring about other people's feelings. So. But you're right on on, the toy doesn't fix it. But we do influence each other with connection. So if the, if the brother says I'm sorry, then your daughter goes, it's okay. Wow, that's resonance. And which allows revision, which is returned to relationship.
Speaker 2:Okay when we're adults, though, like so with the kids and I'm able to kind of coach and guide.
Speaker 1:Yes, training ground.
Speaker 2:Right, yeah, like I can guide the brother through some of that maybe unwillingly at first, but I can kind of guide him through.
Speaker 1:I don't care what you say, mom, but I can kind of get him through.
Speaker 2:I don't care what you say, mom, right, but I'm thinking about when a similar thing happens between two adults, between two married people, between two friends, and there's not that older person that's, you know, seeing it and kind of coaching them through.
Speaker 2:Yeah, you, know seeing it and kind of coaching them through, and how often the, the initial person, like the daughter in this example, feels like something was taken from her, but but then is met with defensiveness. Well, you shouldn't have X, y, z in the first place, right, like? This is a typical, and this is where we, this is where intimacy gets hurt and begins to tear apart in relationship. So then, how? And? And you can't make the other person do it. Or if you try to make the other person apologize, like that's where I'm guessing it's probably going to be well, they didn't mean it, because I basically had to, like, force them to do what I wanted them to do, if they would even do it, if they would even apologize. So how do you? What about that other person, the, you know, the little brother in this scenario, who's just unaware for whatever reason?
Speaker 1:Yes, yes, who just is removed won't see. That's right, doesn't recognize, doesn't recognize, and tough if you've got to pay for it. Yeah, that's what I mean by the mystery of marriage Like this. Think about this People. You've been married for how long?
Speaker 2:14 years.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I've been married 41.
Speaker 2:A little bit longer.
Speaker 1:A little bit longer. But at the same time I look at my marriage and go like this is a miracle, because if any other human being in my world, on both sides of us me or her said some of the things that she said to me, or if some things I've said to her, we wouldn't be friends anymore. I know.
Speaker 2:I understand.
Speaker 1:I'm kind of like, in fact, I would be waiting for the funeral because I wouldn't go.
Speaker 2:It's so true.
Speaker 1:That's a fully vibrant relationship and that's how come covenant is such a big deal Like? We better put a tight circle around this thing because this is work. So we have to face that. It's work because you've got two humans attempting to do something that humans aren't really really good at doing. It's just tough, which means dealing with pain, dealing with sorrow, dealing with loss, and it's through being able to relate to the other person because I am the other person that that's how we stay together, and the tragedy is that so many people will create detente instead of just real community. Detente is like, yeah, we sleep six inches apart, but I don't want to know you and you don't know me. We grow resentment instead of relationship, and relationship really only occurs through this. One silly thing have you ever been to Disney World? Mm-hmm, okay. Have you ever ridden Small World?
Speaker 2:Mm-hmm.
Speaker 1:You have Mm-hmm, like it.
Speaker 2:You know, for the first half.
Speaker 1:I know, I know exactly. So, by the way, I'm six, four, right, and so I'm. I'm getting this little boat with sonja and I've ridden small world probably 15 times, or maybe 10. First time I'm like, you know, this is like brainwashing, I'm not doing brainwashing, it's like it's a small world, it's a small, it's a. And then Sonia said to me did you hear that? I'm like, yes, over and over again, it's a small world after all. She said did you hear what they said? I said no, there's a stanza in the song that's the meaning of the whole ride and it says this it's a world of laughter and a world of tears.
Speaker 1:I don't like it the second part, but it's true, it's a world of hope and a world of fears. Then it says there's so much that we share that it's time we're aware it's a small world after all. And then at the end of the ride, everybody's dressed in a way that it's 100 percent identification with each other and it turns out that the science has shown us that the DNA of the human being were 99.9 percent identical. And what that means is, emotionally and spiritually, we're 99.9 percent identical, not just across all cultures, but up and down throughout history. The first question God ever asked of a human being, thousands of years ago, was the same answer we would deliver. I was afraid I was hurt, because feelings haven't changed since we've been here, and so it's amazing that it's the recognition that when I look at you, I'm looking at me, and that's how we wind up doing regulation the admission of yeah, I can see that, yeah, I would feel that yeah, if you'd said yeah. But a lot of times we need some time between the rough things that are said and the response, because when we get stuck with a knife, the tendency is going to be to defend ourselves, period. That's called instinct, it's called primitive self-preservation, it's called normal. And so to break up instinct, we have to take time to return to how we're made emotionally, spiritually, to re-garner, re-corral love, and we do that through okay. Okay, it's a world of laughter and a world of tears. It's a world of hope and a world of fears. I would feel the same way, or I would be hurt too, or I would be lonely.
Speaker 1:But now the person who relating also needs to hear from the other person the truth. Not like you did this to me, and I feel betrayed. And now, no matter what I don't know if I'll ever forgive you. That's not the truth. Those may be the facts, those may be the experiences. That's not the truth. The truth is, when you betrayed me, I felt so hurt and so lonely. I wasn't sure if my heart could ever be alive again. I have wondered and even been angry at myself for still wanting relationship with you.
Speaker 1:Now, all of a sudden, that's the truth, because it's the heart being expressed using the language of the heart, versus the language of what the other person did. It's the language of my experience of what the other person did. That's powerful. Like you're supposed to rescue me, or your son learning to say I'm sorry, or it's me going no, yeah.
Speaker 1:And then what's amazing is the heart is extremely elastic. Our brains aren't, you know, I know, with neuroplasticity, but the heart is pain tolerant. That's how come relationships are a matter of the heart more than their matter of the mind. But the heart can tolerate pain because it's our hearts that can relate to each other, if we'll be truthful. But we've got to cling to it. It's a world of laughter, a world of tears, a world of hope and a world of fears. But will we share? Will we share Because there's so much that we share that it's time we're aware it's a small world after all, like okay, I got this, and it all occurs through the admission of feelings and then another person being able to relate to the experience of those feelings Big, big.
Speaker 2:Does it have to be your spouse?
Speaker 1:Oh, no, no, no, it can be anyone, you know. Do you know this? There's a. I don't know if this is a Christian podcast or not, but but certainly it's like People know I love Jesus, so you're good.
Speaker 1:It's a humanity podcast and which is like cause. We're all God made before Jesus saved. We're still God made. We're image bearers of God.
Speaker 1:Well, the good Samaritan is a story of. It doesn't have to be your spouse. And Jesus calls the good Samaritan is a story of. It doesn't have to be your spouse. And Jesus calls the good Samaritan the neighbor. Because there was a guy who was saying well, prove this to me, prove this to me. And Jesus said you know, love God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. And the guy says who's my neighbor? Jesus said this there were two priests going along the road who walked past a guy who had been beaten, stripped and thrown in a ditch, and neither one of the priests stopped. They observed the guy over there but they didn't relate to him. But then it says a good Samaritan came along the road.
Speaker 1:Now, a Samaritan is a person who knows he can't get away from the pain of life because a Samaritan is a person who's rejected. He can't get away from the pain of life Because a Samaritan is a person who's rejected. They come into life saying hey, you need to know you're from the poor side and it doesn't matter what kind of clothes you wear, you're from the poor side and it's going to stay poor. It's because you're just trash and you need to just get used to it. And it turns out it's called a good Samaritan and it means that somebody found that kid as a young person and said you've been told one thing, but I'm telling you another. You're worth whatever it takes and I'm staying here until you wake up to that and then you go give this away. So this Good Samaritan got parented, truly parented. And so he went and became productive, truly parenting. And so he went and became productive, successful, what it says.
Speaker 1:As he was going along the way, he went to where the man was and saw him. The two priests looked at him, the Samaritans saw him and when I rode the ride at Small World, I saw, I went, I see, I see, I see. And he saw himself in the ditch and I saw myself in all those children. I saw myself in that song. It's so true. It's what I've been doing for years and years. It's like. I know it's a world of laughter, I know it's a world of tears. I know it's a world of hope, I know it's a world of fears. There's so much that we share. We could. That's time, we're aware. You know what. I'm just like you. I know how to get in a ditch, because somebody got in a ditch for me. So guess what?
Speaker 1:And the good Samaritan had a first aid kit on his donkey. In other words, he was prepared to be hurt, his own or somebody else's. He got in a ditch with a first aid kit. In other words, he knew how to handle hurt because someone had taught him what to do with hurt. He knew how to handle sadness and life's difficulties because he'd already walked through them. In other words, he was experienced at caring for others because he knew how to care for himself, because someone had found him valuable.
Speaker 1:So this possibility goes way outside marriage and to friendship, neighborhoods, community groups. But nothing changes until we know what to do with feelings and we live in a highly reactive society. We live in a very response, a not responsible society, because we still equate feelings as demands or feelings as enemies that need to be gotten rid of. And that's how come Kimberly, that's how come addiction is so prevalent, because addiction is what we do to make our feelings go away. And we live in a society that is overloaded with what we ignore Addiction, cosmetic addiction, power addiction, money addiction, exercise addiction, control addiction. See, the voice of the heart has never made it to the self-help section, because it's not about self-help. It's about admission of I need others to help me so I can grow into somebody who can help others. I mean, I think it's just kind of funny. I'm an unpopular person.
Speaker 2:Where does someone even start?
Speaker 1:It starts with, honestly, it starts with this Living With Heart podcast. I'm just so excited about it. There's also a podcast called the Voice of the Heart podcast. We're starting with the Voice of the Heart book and there's a companion book study. Then there's Needs of the Heart and a companion book study, then there's needs of the heart and a companion book study.
Speaker 1:But it starts with this what am I feeling, what's the truth about what I'm feeling and who do I tell? That's where it starts. So who do you have in your life? You can tell that's not going to judge you or tell you how to fix it, but can be with you in it. Can you tell the truth about it, like ownership. And then can you name it, because the three movements are identifying what I'm feeling, exploring it, what's the truth about it, like what's my part, what's their part, what's my part. And then who do I go to with this? And then who do I go to with this?
Speaker 1:Because, remember, life fulfillment is in connection, it's in relationship. So there has to be a who. There has to be a who Because human beings are not made to live alone. See children, when children are growing up, they're not afraid of death. The younger they are, the less afraid of death they are, but they are terrified of something called alone. I mean literally. You come out of the womb looking for who's looking for you. You come out of the womb crying out, reaching out and craving, and a baby will connect with the skin of the caregiver before they reach for the biological food. So I mean literally, it's that. It's that powerful. There has to be a who, because we're made for relationship and but we're made to be responsible in it with others who can do the same.
Speaker 2:What about the person listening who's thinking? I don't know that I have a who. I don't know that I have someone I feel safe to tell, who's not going to try and fix me. That has to be a really lonely place to be.
Speaker 1:Yes, it is. And you know what. I put out a post on Instagram, one on sadness, one on fear, one on hurt, and you know I barely get a peep right. I put out one on loneliness and it hit 6,000 responses in two days Like wow, and you know, you've seen the research like 2014,. Who do you go to? And at one time it was three. And by 2014, it's none.
Speaker 1:What's amazing is we live in the era, finally, of feelings, the heart and yet, because we're not doing feelings truthfully and vulnerably and responsibly, we're living in the loneliest time we've ever lived in, because we have about 50,000 different ways of not being vulnerable, 50,000 different ways of not being vulnerable and, honestly, technology is throwing us there. I mean, we can invent a world now through AI and distraction, with our phones. We can invent a world and it passes the time of life pretty quickly. That becomes a who, which is somebody who helps us pass time instead of live fully in it. So, but back to your real question was but yeah, but what about the who? Well, if you don't have a who, you can start with your journal and then you can find out where other people who don't have who's go and believe it or not, it's called adult children of alcoholism, adult children of alcoholics and impaired families, because if you don't have a who, something's happened to you and you didn't know what to do with it, which means it was a developmental problem, or you've moved away from where it was healthy and you've gone to where it's unhealthy and you don't know who to connect to. And so churches that do heart are good, but the adult children of impaired families is a great place to get started with the who.
Speaker 1:That naming loneliness and not having a who is normal. But there are a lot of who's in the room who go I get you Just to find out that you're not alone in your loneliness. You can still be lonely, but no longer alone, and remember that the child's worst fear is aloneness. But if you can just have somebody relate to you like I get this, I get it. It's like something happens in us. We actually are connected, though we're still in pain, so we live in an isolated time.
Speaker 2:We do, we do. I didn't even know that was a group. Is it like an AA type group that you can Google and find?
Speaker 1:It's exactly like that. It's a 12-step group and what's funny is there's one set of 12 steps but there are like 60, 80 different 12-step groups, but it's the same 12 steps. And yes, and in that group you practice the 12 steps. But it's about emotional recovery. Any person who's stuck in obsession of whatever depression is also a dead body. That it's. It's moving into emotional. Return to your emotional makeup is vital.
Speaker 1:So, yeah, adultery of alcoholics, and there are a lot of spinoff experiences like CR churches, there's a thing called Regen which is, and all of them have to do with this. I'm admitting that I can't do life alone. I believe that there's something more in life than what I've gotten that can restore me to being whole, and I'm going to give myself to it, and that's what all of these groups are about. And I'm going to give myself to it, and that's what all of these groups are about. I admit that I can't do this by myself and that my willpower and my intellect and my own morality hasn't fixed everything. There's something missing and oh, oh, I know it's the heart, Because we try to use these things to compensate, to escape the vulnerability of relationship.
Speaker 1:And you see, I owned a treatment center for 22 years and we worked predominantly with professionals and physicians, pastors and so on. Everybody who came there had been successful, was successful pro athletes, music people and I remember I would tell them I said look, I know you're smarter than I am, I know you're tougher than I am, I know you're probably a better person, you know perfection wise, but I've got something you don't have. I got my small world back. I got my heart. You lost yours and I want to do what I can to help you get yours back. And what's the heart? It's a world of laughter, a world of tears, a world of hope and a world of fears In other words, anybody out there who can admit that they're human too. You potentially have somebody to connect with, but we live in a world that's running away from what the small world talks about, you know.
Speaker 2:Very much so. Yeah, dr Dodd, this has been an amazing conversation, and having it highly recommend that everyone check out the podcast living with heart podcast, which we will be sure to link to in the show notes, as well as a link to buy your book, the voice of the heart, which we talked a lot about. But also you have another manual that you've put out called the Boy and the Ogre Finding Freedom from Codependency.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yes, a Story of Freedom from Codependency, and it is a. The story is actually rather short, but it's about finding out that normal isn't and that when I return to normal, out that normal isn't and that when I return to normal it feels like I'm doing something wrong. But it's kind of a reverse Garden of Eden story, Like I leave the world to the Garden of Eden, where real life is, and it's a precious story. And then it talks about the six freedoms that were born to live like and that didn't get developed, because every human being is born with six freedoms that, in the community, need to be developed.
Speaker 1:I'm born to see what I see. I'm born to feel what I feel. I hate feelings. I'm born to have the needs that come with the feelings. I'm literally born to talk about what's happening inside of me. I'm born to trust that someone outside of me cares about that, and then I'm literally born to talk about what's happening inside of me. I'm born to trust that someone outside of me cares about that, and then I'm born to imagine myself living fully. I do the first five, have the first five, I will end up living the sixth one, and so the boy in the ogre is about a return to live in the six freedoms and giving up the, the acceptance that comes through denying how I'm made.
Speaker 2:Absolutely incredible.
Speaker 1:I just love it. Let's just say that it's a bad title. I've made a mistake. Who's going to pick up the boy in the ogre, Like whatever?
Speaker 2:It's the tagline that makes it Finding freedom from codependency.
Speaker 1:Exactly, that's the big one. Yeah, so yeah, it's the tagline that makes it finding freedom from codependency.
Speaker 2:That's the big one. Yeah, that's it, we'll definitely include the link to that in the show notes as well.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for your time, dr Dodd. I really appreciate it. Man, there were so many great things that we discussed in today's episode. I have a page full of notes on the bio sheet that I have with Dr Dodd, but just as a recap of all the things we talked about, there are three main reasons that people don't feel feelings or are not aware of the feelings that they feel. One is because of ignorance we just don't know. The second one is denial, because we've pushed our feelings down for so long that we've stopped being able to really feel what they are. And the third one is because we had an experience where we had feelings that we needed to tell someone but there was no one safe to tell them to, and that's what he identified or defined as trauma. Those are great guideposts to really help us understand, maybe, why it can be difficult for some of us to notate what we're feeling, to put our finger on some of those things, and a great place to begin starting.
Speaker 2:We didn't get into what the eight feelings are that Dr Dodd talks about in his book the Voice of the Heart, but I highly recommend that you get it. You could probably also Google it. He talks about the feelings, why those feelings stem. One he talked about was sadness. When we're sad, there's a need for comfort, but ultimately it leads us to need to get to the point of acceptance and there's something true about that, for all of the feelings that we feel. Feelings are expressions of needs that I need to name and responsibility that I need to take. I know that I have been guilty, probably up until today, of having feelings and then having or wanting expecting somebody else to change their ways in order for me to feel better. That's actually not what we're trying to do, and I love the way that he talked about it. When I'm looking at you, I'm looking at me, and it's a different way to think about it. We typically think of compassion or empathy as putting ourselves in someone else's shoes, but I actually like the visual that comes to my mind when I hear that phrase when I'm mad, or when I'm sad, or when you're mad or when you're sad when I can look at you and realize that I'm actually also looking at me. That's how I would feel too.
Speaker 2:It doesn't just personalize the other human that we may be in conflict with. It goes deeper. It allows us to realize or at least as I'm processing it, it allows me to realize that I am more like this person and they are more like me than we are different. So how can we bridge that gap and love each other, instead of what is typical in humans? In humans, and as he said, the instinct is to be defensive. The instinct is to find all the ways you are different than that person and all the ways that you're better than that person. That's what we try to do to protect ourselves when we are sad, hurt, angry, lonely, afraid, shamed. All of those things can lead us to disconnect from the people in our lives, but the goal and the actual beauty of it is that we can use these as the great opportunity to bridge that gap, to see ourselves in the other person and, ultimately, to find more intimacy and deeper relationship.
Speaker 2:I hope you enjoyed this episode. Please share it with a friend. If it's something that you found valuable, talk about it on social media. Share it on social media and leave a review. Reviews are one of the best free ways that you can help support this show and help it reach even more people. Until next week, stay strong.
.png)
